Penfold
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Every other runsWith the new season of EOR's not too far away now  , was anything ever decided on the run format??
There was a lot of debate last year about splitting the run into 2 groups following a couple of incidents last year  .
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Stritchy
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Format will stay the same - drop off system and considerate riding.
I have asked that a certain member does not join us, as his riding is eratic and dangerous.
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Penfold
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| Quote: | | I have asked that a certain member does not join us, as his riding is eratic and dangerous. |
Is that not a bit harsh
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Vampira
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| Penfold wrote: | | Quote: | | I have asked that a certain member does not join us, as his riding is eratic and dangerous. |
Is that not a bit harsh |
Not harsh at all Penfold if you value your life.
He was a total liability last season and we cannot take the risk of him endangering the other riders.
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Penfold
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Was he a total liability or was it a case of an underpowered bike, a lack of experience of group riding and not understanding fully the drop off system, making him ride way out of his comfort zone just to keep up, thus creating the danger?
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Stritchy
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Sorry Penfold.
He he was not improving as time went on and was putting people's lives at risk 
Feel free to mentor his riding and when you think he can cope, we'll give him another go - but it's up to you 
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Penfold
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| Quote: | | Feel free to mentor his riding and when you think he can cope, we'll give him another go - but it's up to you |
Its not up to me . . . I have enough of my own problems keeping up on a group ride out and branch holidays 
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Stritchy
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Alan D
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| Quote: | | was it a case of an underpowered bike, a lack of experience of group riding and not understanding fully the drop off system |
How about a lack of realisation that the bike in front turns sharply left on a tight 90 degree left hand bend?
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Whitey
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Well if he's not aloud to go on the ride outs....maybe i can use his bike so i can go!!!.... 
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Plum
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I remember that run well alan, i was riding behind you and he was in between us, your right, he had no idea that the left hander was ahead and was unaware you were about to turn in, i think thats because he was riding far to close to you, he was watching your back wheel and not the road, it was an accident waiting to happen.
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brosbloke
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Ride Out BriefingsMay I suggest that a briefing be given before each ride out so that everybody present on the night is aware of procedures plus any questions before we go. Time served club members may feel that this is already done but as a newcomer and returning biker last year I was not clear about procedures.
Here are some suggestions - intended as positive input not as some kind of clever dick takeover bid that some may instantly dismiss it as : -
Disclaimer - This is Your Ride. HOC is not responsible for you, go at your own pace and ride safely at all times.
Destination - State clearly where we are going to
Formation - Ride in a staggered pattern on the road to give adequate braking distance
Drop off riders - Must wait for all riders to pass and should indicate and hand signal direction if it is not clear. Must wait for Tail End Charlie before recommencing ride
Keeping up - There is no need to race to keep up, speed is irrelevant if drop off riders exercise care and discipline
Overtaking - Absolutely no overtaking within the group
Tailgating - Do not tailgate keep a safe distance
Stopping - If you need to Stop then Stop - Tail End Charlie will wait with you
Lost - Return to last known point where Tail End Charlie will pick you up unless you have gone off the map
Tail End Charlie - must not overtake stragglers but must stay at the back
Plus anything else that has not dawned on me...............
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Stritchy
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It's a good list Brosbloke.
We do have a briefing before each run (well I do anyway) which covers pretty much what you have suggested. I may well give each run leader your list as a reminder of what needs to be covered
I'd only remove the 'no overtaking' rule.
It removes the need for riders to be aware of what's happening behind them, if they don't believe anyone will overtake.
Overtaking is not a problem provided it is carried out safely.
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Vampira
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On every EOR that we have been on (which during the time we have been members has been all but a handful) there has always been a briefing before the off. Tail End Charlie has always stayed at the back and never overtaken stragglers. The drop off system works well with the most part observing the "marking" however in the event of someone not marking a junction etc the next bike on has marked it.
There have been one or two slight problems on group ride outs, once when one member decided to go home half way through and subsequently had a few followers (could have been overcome has he had a radio). Another time on a large ride out we meet another group of riders and temporally "lost" a couple of riders to the other group.
The group are told to ride in staggered formation and do so. This should avoid large gaps and the need for some to race to keep up.
The reason a certain individual was told not to come on ride outs was simply because he is too dangerous.
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Penfold
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So are you going to be riding on the EOR's this year Sue??
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brosbloke
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Rideout proceduresThank you Strichy for your positive response.
In response to another somewhat defensive post all I can say is that some of the riding last year was downright dangerous - I should know because on occasion I was the rider ! If I felt that anything goes was ok then other newcomers may too.
For your peace of mind I have subsequently put in a load of miles - 300 of them today - attempting to become a reformed character.
Oddly enough I have been overtaken twice on runs by the tail end Charlie, once by the rider of the trike who hooned past regardless, and once by poor Jennie - lumbered with the job on the shortest and coldest ride ever when it turned out not to matter - who was probably frozen solid to the bike anyway.
And yes, that was the day I forgot to put my lights on, yawn............................................
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Vampira
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Actually Keith, Jennie requested to be Tail End Charleen on the New years day run and we were all bloody freezing.
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Shellshine
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Just to clarify ...
I didn't ask to be tail end Charlie, but was happy to be so. It seemed the right option on the day as it was my first ride with the group and I had the slowest bike (and a highly recognisable jacket on!) lol
Yes, lol, I was frozen to the bike, lol, as Sue says, we all were.. and I'm sorry but yes, I did overtake Keith, only because, if memory serves me (and forgive me Keith if my memory fails me as it so often does these days! lol)... you were marking the exit on a roundabout and had not had chance to pull out when you saw me enter the roundabout. Thankfully, like you say, it didn't matter. I did slow down though to let you catch up when it was safe for you to pull out.
Regardless, it really doesn't matter now . It was a ride out without incident and a great social event. (Although bloody freezing!!!)
I like the list. I recognise in it a lot of how things already are. I know it seems a faff, but, just a suggestion, how about printing out a basic 'dos and don'ts' list for ride outs and making sure everyone gets a copy? ]]Don't get me wrong... I'm not an egg-sucking instructor so please don't think I am!! Heaven forbid!! I've been on hundreds of runs and ride outs as a pillion but only a handful as a rider... lol
I'm just trying to help and if everyone is singing from the same hymn sheet... ...
The following came in an email from MCN to me yesterday and I thought it quite pertinent to the discussion and full of familiar tips and advice... I especially think point 3 is a very good one.
- - - - - - - - - - - - -
Riding in a group doesn’t require special skills, but you do need to remember a few points to ensure you have an enjoyable as well as safe ride. Here’s MCN’s top tips for riding in large groups.
1. Keep your distance. Sounds obvious, but bunching up reduces your visibility as well as giving you less time to react to anything that happens. Stagger the group so you’re not riding in each others wheels tracks – the first rider keeps to the right side of the lane, and the next rider rides on the left two bike lengths back, and so on.
2. Keep it smooth. Don’t brake or accelerate hard – if you do the rider behind is likely to do the same, starting a chain reaction.
3. The rider at the front of a very large group should stick below 40mph. Groups covering hundreds of yards tend to spread out, and riders towards the back naturally speed up to catch up if they become separated at junctions. Keeping the lead bike slow prevents people riding too fast to stay in touch.
4. Stay in formation. If someone pulls over, by all means overtake, but pulling out and overtaking the group achieves nothing and creates a new risk.
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Vampira
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Printing off do's and don't's. What a waste of natures resources not to mention people loosing bits of paper.
There could be lots of troubles with the lead bike never going faster than 40mph. Some of the bigger bikes struggle to maintain such low speeds for long distances. On Dan's ride out last year we never got out of 2nd gear as we rode so slow, the poor bike chugged and coughed and still some bikers got lost. Also staying at 40mph or less increases the chances of cars etc getting amongst the "pack" and causing even more problems. Speed limits are set on all roads for a reason and doing 40mph in a 60mph zone is a hazard.
By far the safest way to conduct a ride out is for Run Leader and Tail End Charlie to both have radio's and maintain contact throughout the ride. It's also helpful if everyone knows the destination so, in the event of "getting lost" at least they can meet everyone later if wished.
Everyone to stay in the starting order throughout the ride but adhering to the drop off system, no chance of someone following the wrong bike, as has happened. If you always know who is in front of you things will run smoothly. You may have noticed that we nearly always ask the new members or inexperienced riders to ride towards the end of the group so they can observe how the drop off system works before it's their turn.
If in the rare event that Run Leader does get too far in front, he simply pulls over and waits.
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Shellshine
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*sigh*  was just trying to help...
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Penfold
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I never thought a simple question would stimulate so much interest on here, but it has provided some interesting comments
What I like about the EOR's is you never know what is going to happen.
The first run I lead last year didn't have many junctions, but for some strange reason got very strung out, so I rarely went above 40mph and had to stop 3 times.
For my second run I included a lot of junctions and the opposite happened, I had my mirrors full of bikes for practically the whole run, how odd
| Quote: | | Speed limits are set on all roads for a reason and doing 40mph in a 60mph zone is a hazard. |
I was always told that the limit is the limit and NOT the target you drive/ride to the road conditions.
Quack Quack
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brosbloke
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the rideout sagaIt makes me wonder what it will take to get it through to some people that SAFETY is the number one priority on rideouts.
Contemptuously dismissive stances based upon historical experience are not productive when it comes to promoting the SAFETY of a group of riders of widely varying levels of experience or skill - especially when riders turn up on the night and you can have no idea what to expect from them.
If a see no evil, hear no evil, speak no evil mentality persists then it is certain that a disaster will happen - I just hope I am nowhere near when it does.
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Stritchy
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Re: the rideout saga | brosbloke wrote: | | If a see no evil, hear no evil, speak no evil mentality persists... |
You're implying that that is the case at the moment and nothing could be further from the truth.
The idea behind the EORs is fun, so we are not going to impose anything that detracts from that. However, there is always room for improvement and many of the suggestions will be taken on-board.
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dave & jan
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Can't wait for the ride-out
Dave & Jan
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Alan D
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Part of the "Fun" of an EOR is NOT knowing where you are going to end up. Whilst there is merit is knowing the destination I personaly would rather not know (except for the run I will be leading, I hope )
Could we perhaps have some secret agent cards hand out at the start, containing the destination and only to be opened if you get dislocated from the group 
Of course if you are hopeless lost and don't have a Sat-Nav you'll be worse off knowing where you should be without a clue how to get there
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shaz1
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NICE ONE ALAN ,,,,
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stars
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i ll never ride my bike on a ride out,,,,,
i ll ride on the back of simon's but i ll never ride my own bike on a ride out
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Phil Barberton
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Hey folks.....Safety is important....Very important BUT why do we all get together on a Wednesday night for a EOR.........FUN****FUN***FUN***FUN****FUN***......So let's ENJOY IT. We are not racers....but if someone is going much toooooooooo slow....Then overtake....It's NOT FUN BEING STUCK BEHIND SOMEONE WHO DOES NOT KEEP UP......
So long as it is safe.....does it matter.......
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Vampira
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This whole subject is now getting bitchy. I suggest those who want to participate in the EOR's as they are do so, those who don't stay at home.
Let's have fun...you're a bloody long while dead.
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Penfold
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| Quote: | | This whole subject is now getting bitchy. |
Well there's a surprise.
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Penfold
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| Quote: | | Well there's a surprise. |
Was it something I said that killed this thread?  
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Vampira
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Not at all think the message got through
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